Printer-friendly version
Interrogation: Consists of a psychological warfare and intellectual combat between the intelligence agent and the suspect through questions and answers related to one or more topics. The interrogation uses all kinds of physical and psychological techniques to break the will of the suspect and lead him to a total collapse. The agency that conducts the interrogation is the government's questioning apparatus that belongs to the Ministry of Interior Affairs. The officers of that apparatus graduate from the police academy. In our country, that apparatus has no values or code of ethics. It does not hesitate to use all kinds of torture and bodily and emotional harm to obtain evidence that could incriminate the suspect.
Questioning: Questioning is similar to interrogation in that they are both forms of psychological warfare and intellectual combat. The questioning, however, is conducted by the prosecution [office of district attorney], which is under the judicial branch. That authority is (apparently) independent from the government (executive branch) and from the people's parliament (legislative branch). The prosecution officials graduate from law school and use the technique of confrontation and repeated questioning, but without torture.”
[A]nother session is held using torture in order to control the brother through fright and orders (sit down, don't sit down, face the wall, don't talk, don't raise your voice, curses and insults). The brother should not weaken, but should try to disobey the interrogator's orders or take his time executing them. If the interrogators find that the torture technique is successful, they would intensify it. However, if they find that the brother is dodging them, they would resort to psychological torture techniques.
Some interrogators may try to confuse the brother, distort his reasoning, and tangle his thoughts by throwing many questions at him at the same time and not allowing him the chance to answer them. If the brother delays his answers, he would be struck. During that torture [session], the brother is given a chance to speak, even tell a lie, in return for halting the torture. He is given a sheet of paper and asked to write whatever he wants in return for his release, for not prosecuting him, etc.
Torture Methods: Secret agents use two methods of torture: A) Physical torture; B) Psychological torture
A. Methods of Physical Torture:
• Blindfolding and stripping of clothes
• Hanging by the hands.
• Hanging by the feet [upside down]
• Beating with sticks and electrical wires
• Whipping and beating with sticks and twisted rubber belts
• Forcing the brother to stand naked for long periods of time
• Pouring cold water on the brother's head
• Putting out lighted cigarettes on the brother's skin
• Shocking with an electrical current
• Kicking and punching
• Attacking the brother with vicious dogs
• Making the brother sit on a stake
• Throwing in a septic tank
• Pulling out the nails and hair
• Dragging
• Tying the hands and feet from behind
• Utilizing sharp objects, such as a pocketknife or piece of glass
• Burning with fire
• Sleeping on a bare marble floor without a cover and flooding the cell with salt water
• Standing on toes and against a wall pressing with the fingers for long hours. The brother may be denied sleep, food, drink, and medicine
• Beating on cuts and sore parts of the body
• Giving the brother a lot of water or very watery fruits, such as watermelon, after denying him food and drink. After the brother drinks or eats the fruit, his hands and penis will be tied so the brother will not be able to urinate
• Placing drugs and narcotics in the brother's food to weaken his will power
• Placing the brother in a solitary confinement where the cells are made of a special kind of cement that gets extremely hot in the summer and cold in winter
• Hitting the brother's genitals with a stick or squeezing them by hand
• Dragging the brother over barb wires and fragments of glass and metal
B. Methods of Psychological Torture:
• Isolating the brother socially, cutting him off from public life, placing him in solitary confinement, and denying him news and information in order to make him feel lonely
• Forbidding calling him by name, giving the brother a number, and calling him by that number in order to defeat his morale
• Threatening to summon his sister, mother, wife, or daughter and rape her
• Threatening to rape the brother himself
• Threatening to confiscate his possessions and to have him fired from his employment
• Threatening to cause a permanent physical disability or life imprisonment
• Offer the brother certain enticements (apartment, car, passport, scholarship, etc.)
• Using harsh treatment, insults, and curses to defeat his morale
• Controlling everything the brother does, even in private, whether he is awake or asleep, to convince him that they are in charge. They would force him to bow his head and look down while talking with the guards.
Further, let no one think that the aforementioned techniques are fabrications of our imagination, or that we copied them from spy stories. On the contrary, these are factual incidents in the prisons of Egypt , Syria , Jordan , Saudi Arabia , and all other Arab countries.

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: The Manchester Document was never widely read by members of Al Qaeda. The resistance techniques described within are nothing less than an amateur's approach to evading interrogation. Lying, alleging mistreatment, collaborating on cover stories... these are the techniques used by teenagers who conspire to steal candy from a convenience store.
Q: Mr. Secretary, you said, that for the most part, the detainees will be treated in a manner consistent with the Geneva Convention. Exactly which parts, which rights, privileges of the Geneva Convention will they have, and who will decide, and when will it be decided on an ad hoc basis? And just as a follow-up, can you say if there's been any –
Rumsfeld: Well, let me work on that for a minute. That's a mouthful.
What we've said from the beginning is that these are unlawful combatants in our view, and we're detaining them. We call them detainees, not prisoners of war. We call them detainees. We have said that, you know, being the kind of a country we are, it's our intention to recognize that there are certain standards that are generally appropriate for treating people who were—are prisoners of war, which these people are not, and—in our view—but there—and, you know, to the extent that it's reasonable, we will end up using roughly that standard. And that's what we're doing. I don't—I wouldn't want to say that I know in any instance where we would deviate from that or where we might exceed it. But I'm sure we'll probably be on both sides of it modestly….
Q: But why is it important that you not consider them—in other words, why not just treat them as prisoners of war? If prisoners of war get additional rights and protections, why not just treat them that way?
Rumsfeld: That's basically what we're doing. That's what I've said. We're generally conforming to the Geneva Convention as it applies to prisoners of war. That's what that—
Q: Why not let it officially apply?
Rumsfeld: Well, first of all, we don't have to. And second, I—we're still in the very early stages of this, and we're in the process of trying to figure out the answers to all of this and how—what's the best way to do it? What's the proper way to do it? How will we feel good about having done it a certain way? And what is appropriate? And those are the kinds of things that we're going through, because, as I say, there's hundreds of these people, and more coming from the ones that are being detained by our friends.
And so we're trying to rapidly build detention areas that are appropriate, and we're trying to train people to—military people to handle hard-case detainees, and—when that isn't what they normally do when they get up in the morning. And we're just trying to get it right.
Of course, our values as a nation, values that we share with many nations in the world, call for us to treat detainees humanely, including those who are not legally entitled to such treatment. Our nation has been and will continue to be a strong supporter of Geneva and its principles. As a matter of policy, the United States Armed Forces shall continue to treat detainees humanely and, to the extent appropriate and consistent with military necessity, in a manner consistent with the principles of Geneva.
[Redacted] recalled one portion of the video where the detainees were hooded and kneeling in what was referred to as the “pumpkin patch.” Various military personnel were yelling and screaming at the detainees while they were kneeling in the pumpkin patch. [Redacted] advised that the “pumpkin patch” refers to the manner in which the detainees are placed on the tarmac when they arrive and are removed from the aircraft. [Redacted] recalled that while one soldier was yelling at a detainee in the pumpkin patch the detainee just passed out. [Redacted] characterized the video as “hard core.” Also, [Redacted] thought at the time that it was bizarre the military was showing them this video. [Redacted] recalled that there were some military dogs in the video that were apparently used to control and disorient the detainees when they first arrived.
The Agents often had to calm the detainees down b/c the detainees thought that there were going to be killed after entering the interview shacks. The detainees were used to a much different environment in Afghanistan or their home country. Some detainees clearly felt that they were going to be harshly treated or killed as part of being questioned. The Agents had to reassure the detainees that all they wanted to do [was] to talk to them.
Even in the absence of isolation, profound and uncontrolled anxiety is disorganizing…The newly arrested prisoner does not know how long he will be confined, how he will be punished, or with what he will be charged. He does know that his punishment may be anything up to death or permanent imprisonment. Many prisoners say that uncertainty is the most unbearable aspect of the whole experience….
But, if these alone are not enough to produce the desired effect, the officer in charge has other simple and highly effective ways of applying pressure. Two of the most effective of these are fatigue and lack of sleep . The constant light in the cell and the necessity of maintaining a rigid position in bed compound the effects of anxiety and nightmares in producing sleep disturbances. If these are not enough, it is easy to have the guards awaken the prisoners at intervals. This is especially effective if the prisoner is always awakened as soon as he drops off to sleep. The guards can also shorten the hours available for sleep, or deny sleep altogether. Continued loss of sleep produces clouding of consciousness and a loss of alertness, both of which impair the victim's ability to sustain isolation. It also produces profound fatigue.
Another simple and effective type of pressure is that of maintaining the temperature of the cell at a level which is either too hot or too cold for comfort. Continuous heat, at a level at which constant sweating is necessary in order to maintain body temperature, is enervating and fatigue producing. Sustained cold is uncomfortable and poorly tolerated. Yet another method of creating pressure is to reduce the food ration to the point at which the prisoner is constantly hungry. This usually involved loss of weight, which is often associated with weakness and asthenia. Furthermore, deprivation of food produces lassitude, loss of general interest and some breakdown of courage. Some people become profoundly depressed when deprived of food….
The Communists do not look upon these methods as “torture.” Undoubtedly, they use the methods which they do in order to conform, in a typical legalistic manner to overt Communist principles which demand that “no force or torture be used in extracting information from prisoners.” But these methods do, of course, constitute torture and physical coercion. All of them lead to serious disturbances of many bodily processes.”
CHART 1 – COMMUNIST COERCIVE METHODS FOR ELICITING INDIVIDUALCOMPLIANCE
|
General Method |
Effects (Purposes?) |
Variants |
|
1. Isolation |
Deprives Victim of all Social Support of his Ability to Resist
Develops an Intense Concern with Self
Makes Victim Dependent on Interrogator |
Complete Solitary Confinement
Complete Isolation
Semi-Isolation
Group Isolation |
|
2. Monopolization of Perception |
Fixes Attention upon Immediate
Predicament; Fosters Introspection
Eliminates Stimuli Competing with those Controlled by Captor
Frustrates all Actions not Consistent with Compliance |
Physical Isolation
Darkness or Bright Light
Barren Environment
Restricted Movement
Monotonous Food |
|
3. Induced Debilitation;
Exhaustion |
Weakens Mental and Physical Ability to Resist |
Semi-Starvation
Exposure
Exploitation of Wounds; Induced
Illness
Sleep Deprivation
Prolonged Constraint
Prolonged Interrogation or Forced Writing
Over Exertion |
|
4. Threats |
Cultivates Anxiety and Despair |
Threats of Death
Threats of Non-repatriation
Threats of Endless Isolation and
Interrogation
Vague threats
Threats Against Family
Mysterious Changes of Treatment |
|
5. Occasional Indulgences |
Provides Positive Motivation for
Compliance
Hinders Adjustment to Deprivation |
Occasional Favors
Fluctuations of Interrogators' Attitudes
Promises
Rewards for Partial Compliance
Tantalizing |
|
6. Demonstrating “Omnipotence” and “Omniscience” |
Suggests Futility of Resistance |
Confrontations
Pretending Cooperation Taken for Granted
Demonstrating Complete
Control over Victim's Fate |
7. Degradation |
Makes Costs of Resistance Appear
More Damaging to Self-Esteem than Capitulation
Reduces Prisoner to “Animal Level” Concerns |
Personal Hygiene Prevented
Filthy, Infested Surroundings
Demeaning Punishments
Insults and Taunts
Denial of Privacy |
|
8. Enforcing Trivial
Demands |
Develops Habit of Compliance |
Forced Writing
Enforcement of Minute Rules |

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: A couple of points -- first, neither of these psychologists had ever performed an interrogation. Secondly, why did the DoD and former Administration not turn to veteran interrogators? Why not consult those who had interrogated in the First Gulf War? Or those who had interrogated "hardcore" Japanese POWs during WWII? The answer, appears to lie in the prejudice that these individuals held against Arabs and Muslims.
The presentation on detainee “exploitation” described phases of exploitation and included instruction on initial capture and handling, conducting interrogations, and long-term exploitation. The exploitation presentation also included slides on “isolation and degradation,” “sensory deprivation,” “physiological pressures,” and “psychological pressures.” At SERE school, each of these terms has special meaning.
The [redacted] instructor guide describes “isolation” as “a main building block of the exploitation process” and says that it allows the captor total control over personal inputs to the captive.” With respect to degradation, the guide contains examples of the methods used by SERE instructors to take away the “personal dignity” of students at SERE school. Examples of degradation techniques used at SERE school include [redacted]. Mr. Witsch, the JPRA instructor who led the March 8, 2002 training, told the Committee that stripping could also be considered a degradation tactic.”
Another slide describing captor motives states: establish absolute control, induce dependence to meet needs, elicit compliance, shape cooperation….In other JPRA materials, techniques designed to achieve these goals include isolation or solitary confinement, induced physical weakness and exhaustion, degradation, conditioning, sensory deprivation, sensory overload, disruption of sleep and biorhythms, and manipulation of diet.Physical Pressures Used in Resistance Training and Against American Prisoners and Detainees.”
How I became the JTF-170 Commander? I was working at the National Security Agency. On 14 February 2002, I was contacted to meet with the SECDEF. I received a joint service billet description. I met with the SECDEF on the 20 th or 21 st of February 2002, along with the Deputy SECDEF, Wolfowitz and a number of other personnel.
The SECDEF told me that DoD had accumulated a number of bad guys. He wanted to set up interrogation operations and to identify the senior Taliban and senior operatives and to obtain information on what they were going to do regarding their operations and structure.
The SECDEF said he wanted a product and he wanted intelligence now. He told me what he wanted; not how to do it.
Initially, I was told that I would answer to the SECDEF and USSOUTHCOM. I did not have to deal with USCENTCOM. Their mission had nothing to do with my mission. Everything had to go up to USSOUTHCOM then to JCS. The directions changed and I got my marching orders from the President of the United States . I was told by the SECDEF that he wanted me back in Washington DC every week to brief him.
Q: If these guys are so dangerous and they're so –
Rumsfeld: The implication being they're not?
Q: No, No, No.
Rumsfeld: Oh.
Q: I'm just saying, since they are, how is it that we're able to get specific information on, you know, al Qaeda leaders? In other words, they're obviously not willing to give us that kind of information. Are some of them just deciding that it's best for them to give us the information? Is there a large number of them that are willing to do the interviews?
Rumsfeld: There's several aspects to it, and one aspect is that there are Taliban who know things about al Qaeda. And they may not be as hard-core as the al Qaeda, but they may have worked in close proximity with them. They may have been functionaries for them. They may have been couriers for them. They may have been whatever. And so that's one location. Some other people just may decide that the better—you know, that—“that's enough of that, and maybe I'll just go ahead and cooperate and see if I can get myself in a better circumstance.”
Mr. Becker also told the Committee that on several occasions, MG Dunlavey had advised him that the office of Deputy Secretary of Defense had called to express concern about the insufficient intelligence productions at GTMO. Mr. Becker recalled MG Dunlavey telling him after one of these calls, that the Deputy Secretary himself said that GTMO should use more aggressive techniques.
[T]his is my opinion, even though they were giving information and some of it was useful, while we were there a large part of the time we were focused on trying to establish a link between Al Qaeda and Iraq and we were not being successful in establishing a link between Al Qaeda and Iraq. The more frustrated people got in not being able to establish this link … there was more and more pressure to resort to measures that might produce more immediate results.
Three of us; [redacted] [the enlisted psychiatric technician], and I, were hijacked and immediately inprocessed into Joint Task Force 170, the military intelligence command on the island. It turns out we were assigned to the interrogation element because Joint Task Force 170 had authorizations for a psychiatrist, a psychologist, and a psychiatric technician on its duty roster but nobody had been deployed to fill these positions. Nobody really knew what we were supposed to do for the unit, but at least the duty roster had its positions filled.
He said he did not know when to pray because the window was covered up and he could not tell what time of day it was. In addition, he said that he did not know the direction of Mecca . Al-Qahtani told the OIG that the entire time he was at the Brig the guards covered their faces when they dealt with him. He also said he was not allowed any recreation, and while he was allowed into the hallway outside his cell, he never saw the sun. Al-Qahtani said the lights in his cell were left on continuously for the entire time he was there, which he said was half a year. Al-Qahtani also described the Brig as very, very cold. He said he sometimes had a mattress, but if the interrogators did not like his answers, they would take things like that away. . Explaining Qahtani's exaggerated sense of how long his experience in the Brig lasted, Soufan told the IG, “One of the side-effects of isolating a detainee is that they lose their anchor to time or a sense of time.”
According to Al-Qahtani, [Soufan] said things such as “you will find yourself in a difficult situation if you don't talk to me” and “if you're not going to talk now, you will talk in the future.” When asked if he took this as a “warning or a threat,” Al-Qahtani replied that it was “a little bit of both.”
[I]t became apparent to me as early as August 2002, and probably earlier to other State Department personnel who were focused on these issues, that many of the prisoners detained at Guantánamo had been taken into custody without regard to whether they were truly enemy combatants, or in fact whether many of them were enemies at all. I soon realized from my conversations with military colleagues as well as foreign service officers in the field that many of the detainees were, in fact, the victims of incompetent battlefield vetting….
In fact, by late August 2002, I found that of the initial 742 detainees that had arrived at Guantánamo, the majority of them had never seen a U.S. soldier in the process of their initial detention and their captivity had not been subject to any meaningful review…. Secretary Powell was…trying to bring pressure to bear regarding a number of specific detentions because children as young as 12 or 13 and elderly as old as 92 or 93 had been shipped to Guantánamo. By that time, I also understood that the deliberate choice to send detainees to Guantánamo was an attempt to place them outside the jurisdiction of the U.S. legal system.
MG Dunlavey and later MG Miller referred to GTMO as a “ Battle Lab” meaning that interrogators and other procedures there were to some degree experimental, and their lessons would benefit DOD in other places. While this was logical in terms of learning lessons, I personally objected to the implied philosophy that interrogators should experiment with untested methods, particularly those in which they were not trained.
The President's 7 Feb 2002 POTUS memo states, “As a matter of policy, the United States Armed Forces shall continue to treat detainees humanely and, to the extent appropriate and consistent with military necessity, in a manner consistent with the principle of Geneva .” Therefore, CITF will employ interview methods or techniques that are consistent with the Geneva protections and the President's memo. These methods are designed to ensure that all information from [Detained Persons] is taken voluntarily.
I highly recommend we continue to remain in an advisory role and not get directly involved in the actual operations—GTMO in particular. We have no actual experience in real world prisoner handling. The concepts we are most familiar with relate to our past enemies and we have developed our Code of Conduct based on these experiences. Without actual experience with [Designated Unlawful Combatants] we are making the assumption that procedures we use to exploit our personnel will be effective against the current detainees.
What do we bring to the table? We are Code of Conduct instructors with a vast amount of experience training highly intelligent, disciplined, and motivated DoD personnel to resist captivity… We base our role-play laboratories on what we know our former enemies have done to our personnel in captivity. It is based on illegal exploitation (under the rules listed in the 1949 Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War) or prisoners over the last 50 years….
We are out of our sphere when we begin to profess the proper ways to exploit these detainees. We are now attempting to educate lower level personnel in DoD and OGAs with concepts and principles that are somewhat foreign to them and while it all sounds good they are not in a position nor do they have the depth of knowledge in these matters to effect change and do it in reasonable safety.
The handling of [Designated Unlawful Combatants] is a screwed up mess and everyone is scrambling to unscrew the mess.”
DoD Intelligence personnel contacted FBI [Supervisory Special Agent] in order to conduct an interview of a detainee assigned to the FBI. The DoD personnel indicated that they intend to employ the following interrogation techniques: drive the hooded detainee around the island to disorient him, disrobe him to his underwear, have an interrogator with an Egyptian accent (it is known among the detainees that Egyptians are aggressive interrogators and commonly use coercion, to include maiming)….
As a law enforcement agency, CITF is clearly prohibited from participating in these techniques and we also do not want to turn a deaf ear when we learn of these issues.
The purpose of the trip was to review the facilities for Taliban and al Qaeda detainees in U.S. military custody. On the plane I was introduced to many important legal players in the administration, including David Addington, Patrick Philbin, John Rizzo (then the number-two lawyer in the CIA, and now its acting General Counsel), Alice Fisher (now head of the Criminal Division at the Department of Justice), and several Pentagon lawyers. A little over three hours later, we landed in tropical Cuba , took a twenty-minute ferry across Guantanamo Bay , and boarded a bus for a brief ride to Camp Delta , the new detention facility. After a briefing on the operation of the camp from military officials, we walked through a detention building that held two-dozen orange jumpsuit-clad prisoners in mesh cells, each of which contained a bed, a sink, a toilet, and a copy of the Koran. Some of the detainees ignored us. Some stared at us with an empty gaze. Some looked at us with an anger that I had never before experienced. We next witnessed an ongoing interrogation, toured the camp's medical facilities, and saw the spot where construction was about to begin on a building to house military commissions. And then we took the bus and ferry trip back to the plane and, three hours after we arrived, left the island.
MG Dunlavey held private conversations with Mr. Haynes and a few others and briefed the entire group on a number of issues including “policy constraints” affecting interrogations at the JTF. For example, MG Dunlavey told the group that JTF-170 would “like to take Koran away from some detainees—hold it as incentive” but that the issue was undergoing a policy determination by SOUTHCOM. The trip report noted that Mr. Haynes “opined that JTF-170 should have the authority in place to make those calls, per [the President's] order, adding that he “[t]hought JTF-170 would have more freedom to command.” MG Dunlavey told the Committee that he may have told the group during their visit that JTF-170 was working on a request for authority to use additional interrogation techniques.”
Here's the latest regarding our friend.
The most recent Interrogation Plan has been signed off on by the appropriate (all the way up to the 2 star) DOD individuals. As it presently stands, tomorrow night (10/2/2002 – Wednesday @ 2300 hours) # 063 will be picked up at the Brig (totally manacled, hooded, and gagged) for transport to Delta. After the transport, the detainee will be unhooded, allowed to look around to ensure that he is in fact at Delta. He will then be taken to one of the CTC trailers where he will be asked four (4) ‘core' questions. If he is uncooperative, as everyone believes he will be, he will then be immediately transported to a holding cell at Camp X-Ray .
Once at X-Ray, the DHS will begin the interrogation process with 2 interrogators and one of their ‘Behavioral Scientists' observing. After a 6 hour session, the DHS has another team to continue with the scenario. The lead team will then take the third 6 hour sessions (myself and [redacted] been specifically asked to observe this team from a strictly behavioral perspective). After this 18 hour period, the detainee will be allowed to rest for 4 hours before the process will begin again for a yet-to-be determined time frame.
[Redacted] and I made it very clear that we would be available for observation only for the initial time at Delta and then for the initial lead DHS team 6 hour session. After that, we will be “on call” should something positive happen. We had an hour meeting this afternoon with all DHS team personnel to get everyone up to speed on what was happening. The DHS group, including Lt. Col. [redacted] feels confident that this will do what needs to be done to obtain # 063's cooperation.
SSA [redacted] has been fully briefed of this session.
[Redacted] It is our recommendation [redacted] and myself) that should FBIHQ want to send anyone down to question # 063 concerning FBI issues, that they wait at least a week after the aforementioned DHS mission has been completed.
Experts in the field of interrogation indicate the most effective interrogation strategy is a rapport-building approach. Interrogation techniques that rely on physical or adverse consequences are likely to garner inaccurate information and create an increased level of resistance….There is no evidence that the level of fear or discomfort evoked by a given technique has any consistent correlation to the volume or quality of information obtained….The interrogation tools outlined could affect the short term and/or long term physical and/or mental health of the detainee. Physical and/or emotional harm from the above techniques may emerge months or years after their use. It is impossible to determine if a particular strategy will cause irreversible harm if employed….Individuals employing Category II and Category III interrogation techniques must be thoroughly trained…[and] carefully selected, to include a mental health screening (such screenings are SOP for SERE and other Special Operations personnel).
BSCT continued:
• Psychological stressors are extremely effective (ie, sleep deprivation, withholding food, isolation, loss of time)
COL Cummings: We can't do sleep deprivation
LTC Beaver: Yes, we can – with approval
• Disrupting the normal camp operations is vital. We need to create an environment of “controlled chaos”
LTC Beaver: We may need to curb the harsher operations while ICRC is around. It is better not to expose them to any controversial techniques. We must have the support of the DOD.
Becker: We have had many reports from Bagram about sleep deprivation being used.
LTC Beaver: True, but officially it is not happening. It is not being reported officially. The ICRC is a serious concern. They will be in and out, scrutinizing our operations, unless they are displeased and decide to protest and leave. This would draw a lot of negative attention.
COL Cummings: The new PSYOP plan has been passed up the chain
LTC Beaver: It's at J3 at SOUTHCOM
Fredman: The DOJ has provided much guidance on this issue. The CIA is not held to the same rules as the military. In the past when the ICRC has made a big deal about certain detainees, the DOD has “moved” them away from the attention of the ICRC. Upon questioning from the ICRC about their whereabouts, the DOD's response has repeatedly been that the detainee merited no status under the Geneva Convention.
The CIA has employed aggressive techniques on less than a handful of suspects since 9/11.
Under the Torture Convention, torture has been prohibited by international law, but the language of the statutes is written vaguely. Severe mental and physical pain is prohibited. The mental part is explained as poorly as the physical. Severe physical pain described as anything causing permanent damage to major organs or body parts. Mental torture described as anything leading to permanent profound damage to the senses or personality. It is basically subject to perception. If the detainee dies you're doing it wrong. So far, the techniques we have addressed have not proved to produce these types of results, which in a way challenges what the BSCT paper says about not being able to prove whether these techniques will lead to permanent damage. Everything on the BSCT white paper is legal from a civilian standpoint [Any questions of severe weather or temperature conditions should be deferred to medical staff.] Any of the techniques that lie on the harshest end of the spectrum must be performed by a highly trained individual. Medical personnel should be present to treat any possible accidents. The CIA operates without military intervention. When the CIA has wanted to use more aggressive techniques in the past, the FBI has pulled their personnel from theatre. In those rare instances, aggressive techniques have proven very helpful.
LTC Beaver: We will need documentation to protect us
Fredman: Yes, if someone dies while aggressive techniques are being used, regardless of cause of death, the backlash of attention would be detrimental. Everything must be approved and documented.
Fredman: The Torture Convention prohibits torture and cruel, inhumane and degrading treatment. The US did not sign up to the second part, because of the 8 th amendment (cruel and unusual punishment), but we did sign the part about torture. This gives us more license to use more controversial techniques.
LTC Beaver: Does SERE employ the “wet towel” technique?
Fredman: If a well-trained individual is used to perform this technique it can feel like you're drowning. The lymphatic system will react as if you're suffocating, but your body will not cease to function. It is very effective to identify phobias with them (ie, insects, snakes, claustrophobia). The level of resistance is directly related to person's experience
MAJ Burney: Whether or not significant stress occurs lies in the eyes of the beholder. The burden of proof is the big issue. It is very difficult to disprove someone else's PTSD
Fredman: These techniques need involvement from interrogators, psych, medical, legal, etc.
Becker: Would we get blanket approval or would it be case by case?
Fredman: The CIA makes the call internally on most of the types of techniques found in the BSCT paper, and this discussion. Significantly harsh techniques are approved through DOJ.
LTC Phifer: Who approves ours? The CG? COUTHCOM CG?
Fredman: Does the Geneva Convention apply? The CIA rallied for it not to.
LTC Phifer: Can we get DOJ opinion about these topics on paper?
LTC Beaver: Will it go from DOJ to DOD?
LTC Phifer: Can we get to see a CIA request to use advanced aggressive techniques?
Fredman: Yes, but we can't provide you with a copy. You will probably be able to look at it.
Sam:
We need to ensure seniors at OGC are aware of the [JTF]170 strategies and how it might impact CITF and Commissions. This looks like the kinds of stuff Congressional hearings are made of. Quotes from LLTC Beaver regarding things that are not being reported give the appearance of impropriety. Other comments like “It is basically subject to perception. If the detainee dies you're doing it wrong” and “Any of the techniques that lie on the harshest end of the spectrum must be performed by a highly trained individual. Medical personnel should present to treat any possible accidents” seem to stretch beyond the bounds of legal propriety. Talk of “wet towel treatment” which results in the lymphatic gland reacting as if you are suffocating, would in my opinion, shock the conscience of any legal body looking at using the results of the interrogations or possibly even the interrogators. Someone needs to be considering how history will look back at this.
I do not envy you. I suspect I know where this is coming from. The answer is no, I do not know of anyone who could provide that training….The training that SERE instructors receive is designed to simulate that of a foreign power, and to do so in a manner that encourages resistance among the students. I do not believe that training interrogators to use what SERE instructors use would be particularly productive.
Al-Qahtani was interrogated by another military interrogation team from October 3 until the early morning hours of October 4. Lyle said Al-Qahtani was “aggressively” interrogated and that the plan was to “keep him up until he broke.” Foy said he did not know if that ultimately is what happened, because he and Lyle stopped observing the process. Foy stated in an e-mail to the FBI Unit Chief and the OSC at GTMO the next morning that an FBI approach to Al-Qahtani the following week would not be worthwhile “due to the current mental/physical status of the detainee.”
Foy and Lyle returned to Camp X-Ray in the late afternoon of October to continue their observations. Lyle told the OIG that one of the interrogators, a Marine Captain, had been interrogating Al-Qahtani by yelling at him and calling him names. Lyle stated that the Captain got up on the table in the room to yell at Al-Qahtani in a more intimidating fashion, at which point he squatted over a Koran that had been provided to Al-Qahtani. This action incensed Al-Qahtani, who lunged toward the Captain and the Koran. Al-Qahtani was quickly subdued by the military guards in the room. Foy gave a similar account of this incident….
Lyle and Foy also described an incident the next day in which a guard received a signal to bring a working dog into the interrogation room where Al-Qahtani was being interrogated. Lyle said that the use of dogs as an interrogation tool was exclusively the military's idea, based on their belief that Arabs feared dogs because they viewed dogs as unclean. Lyle said that the guard handling the dog first agitated the dog outside the interrogation room, and then brought the dog into the room close to Al-Qahtani. Lyle said that the dog barked, growled, and snarled at Al-Qahtani in very close proximity to him, but was never allowed to have contact with him. Foy gave a similar account of the incident, and told the OIG that he and Lyle were not comfortable with the situation with the dog so they left the interrogation.

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: We continue to see this theme repeated throughout The Torture Report -- prejudice-based stereotypes influencing the interrogation techniques.
Repeatedly you ask yourself -- Where are the commanders? Where is the leadership? Where is the mature voice of reason?
Hello from GTMO,
As of 10/08/2002 (Tuesday) @ 1800 hours, DHS will discontinue their current efforts regarding # 063. Besides the sleep deprivation, they utilized loud music, bright lights, and “body placement discomfort,” all with negative results. The asked [redacted] and I to participate in an ‘after action' on this phase which we will probably do. At present, the plan is for DHS to initiate their Phase II on # 063 sometime this weekend.
The detainee is down to around 100 pounds but is still as fervent as ever. That's it for now, more to follow after the aforementioned meeting.
so long as the force used could plausibly have been thought necessary in a particular situation to achieve a legitimate governmental objective, and it was applied in a good faith effort and not maliciously or sadistically for the very purpose of causing harm, the proposed techniques are likely to pass constitutional muster. The federal torture statute will not be violated so long as any of the proposed strategies are not specifically intended to cause severe physical pain or suffering or prolonged mental harm. Assuming that severe physical pain is not inflicted, absent any evidence that any of these strategies will in fact cause prolonged and long lasting mental harm, the proposed methods will not violate the statute.
With respect to the Category III advanced counter-resistance strategies, the use of scenarios designed to convince the detainee that death or severely painful consequences are imminent is not illegal for the same aforementioned reasons that there is a compelling governmental interest and it is not done intentionally to cause harm. However, caution should be utilized with this technique because the torture statute specifically mentions making death threats as an example of inflicting mental pain and suffering. Exposure to cold weather or water is permissible with appropriate medical monitoring. The use of a wet towel to induce the misperception of suffocation would also be permissible if not done with the specific intent to cause prolonged mental harm, and absent medical evidence that it would. Caution should be exercised with this method, as foreign courts have already advised about the potential mental harm that this method may cause. The use of physical contact with the detainee, such as pushing and poking will technically constitute an assault under Article 128, UCMJ.

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: Another theme throughout the The Torture Report is the military leadership's refusal to acknowledge that EITs violate the Uniformed Code of Military Justice. This willingness to ignore UCMJ for interrogations certainly led to other crimes being committed by U.S. soldiers who believed 'the gloves were off.'
I am uncertain whether all the techniques in the third category are legal under U.S. law, given the absence of judicial interpretation of the U.S. torture statute. I am particularly troubled by the use of implied or expressed threats of death of the detainee or his family. However, I desire to have as many options as possible at my disposal and therefore request the Department of Defense and Department of Justice lawyers review the third category of techniques.
As lawyers we're talking about adherence to the rule of law being important, and that's what we're trying to tell everybody as we travel around the world to these other countries. That's paramount to democracy. And so suddenly we look like we're brushing this aside or we're twisting the law. The feeling was that the decision makers within the Pentagon didn't much care about that. They cared about winning the War on Terrorism. And if that meant you had to pull out fingernails you'd pull out fingernails, figuratively speaking.
According to CAPT Dalton, after she and her staff initiated their analysis, CJCS GEN Myers directed her to stop that review. CAPT Dalton said that GEN Myers returned from a meeting and “advised me that [DoD General Counsel] Mr. Haynes wanted me…to cancel the video teleconference and to stop” conducting the review because of concerns that “people were going to see” the GTMO request and the military services' analysis of it. According to CAPT Dalton, Mr. Haynes “wanted to keep it much more close hold.” When CAPT Dalton “learned that [the DoD General Counsel] did not want that broad based legal and policy review to take place,” she and her staff stopped the review. This was the only time that CAPT Dalton had ever been asked to stop analyzing a request that came to her for her review.

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: This is one of the most important moments in the entire decision-making process that resulted in the torture and abuse of detainees. The senior ranking military officer in the United States stops a legal review of the techniques by the services when they advise that EITs violate the law. This was a perfect opportunity for General Myers to stand up and say that these techniques violated everything we stand for in the military and he would have had the full support of all four services behind him. Instead, he decided to 'play game', sacrificing our principles in exchange for what was politically convenient, but morally incomprehensible. If the military had investigated torture and abuse as a crime, as it should have, this would have led to several charges being filed against Gen Myers including abuse of authority and conspiracy, just to name two.
At that point the FBI Unit Chief said he spoke up and said “look, everything you've gotten thus far is what the FBI gave you on Al-Qahtani from its paper investigation.” The Unit Chief said the conversation became heated. According to the Unit Chief, the Chief CITF Psychologist and Nahmias agreed that the information the Lieutenant Colonel presented had been provided by the FBI and that the Lieutenant Colonel's suggested interrogation methods were not effective and were not providing positive intelligence. The Unit Chief said that the meeting ended because of the controversy.
The third phase of the plan to exploit 063 requires OSD approval for the SERE interrogation technique training and approval of the level three counter interrogation resistance training submitted by JTF-GTMO. Once the approvals are in place, those interrogation techniques will be implemented to encourage 063 to cooperate.
The fourth phase of the plan to exploit 063 required that he be sent off-island either temporarily or permanently to either Jordan or Egypt, or another country to allow those countries to employ interrogation techniques that will enable them to obtain the requisite information.
I strongly disagree with the use of many of the proposed [Category] 3 and some [Category] 2 techniques. I feel they will be largely ineffective, and that will have serious negative material and legal effects on our investigations. I also am extremely concerned that the use of many of these techniques will open our military members up for potential criminal charges, and that my agents, as well as other [military personnel] will face both legal and ethical problems if they become aware of their use.”
As promised, attached is a “hybrid” plan for #63 that incorporates a phase where our desired techniques are employed. DOD here on the ground agreed to this plan and will discuss it during the 1600 meeting today. I believe that is the same meeting you are attending. We are also sending the plan to the BAU for their review. We remain ambivalent about this hybrid approach even though they bought off on a rapport building phase one. One of the downsides is that it is not a plan that allows for a long term rapport building technique. Success or failure will be determined in 5-7 days before moving on to the next phase. Also attached is a narrative written by [redacted] which advocates a long term approach—also being sent to BAU. A concern with embracing the hybrid approach is that there will be many variables that we will have no control over. As I understand it, we are not to participate with DOD in the actual interrogation. I think this is wise. However, in order to further diplomacy we met with DOD at its request, to determine if there was any middle ground between their approach and our proposed approach. The hybrid approach was that middle ground. But we still have misgivings:
1. The DHS plan seems better suited for the battlefield and not for long-term detainees
2. Although very enthusiastic, DHS interrogators appear to have limited experience in any kind of interview approach which emphasized patience or being friendly over a long period of time. They appear to be highly susceptible to pressure to get quick results, and this pressure will be reflected in they improvise plans as they go along.
3. The reliability of the interview techniques is questionable. Worse, there appears to be no one on the DHS side who seems to be concerned about this. They are quick to dismiss any approach that extends beyond their experience or imagination.
4. Their embracement of a fear-based approach is consistent with the military environment in which they operate, but may not be conducive to the long term goal of obtaining reliable intelligence.
I know that you may have news for us following your 1600 meet. Please review the documents attached and advise as to whether we should participate further in any way or gracefully back out on this one. If you want us to back out, I request that HQ provide a written communication directing us not to get involved. Otherwise, our continued dealings with the other agencies are cramped.
[From [redacted]>> Although I agree with the above, I think DHS will likely revert back to their original plan, which basically begins with Phase II of this hybrid plan, if we don't give our blessing to the hybrid plan. While the hybrid is not the best plan, I do believe it is the lesser of two evils. I also believe that this hybrid plan does simulate some of the important factors found in Stockholm Syndrome cases. Specifically, extended hours awake under increased stress continuing over a number of days, extended periods of time where rapport may be developed and the interviewer can become humanized in the detainee's eyes, opportunity for the detainee to be convinced that they are going through this ordeal together, all work together to possibly accelerate the bonding process. For these reasons I think this hybrid has more opportunity for success that the DHS original plan.
From: FBI Guantanamo Bay
Subject: VTC 21 November 2002
To: Major General Miller
The purpose of this correspondence is to bring to the Commanding General's attention concerns that FBI has regarding representations that were made about the FBI's position on the proposed operational approach to [redacted] at the 21 November VTC.
At the direction of the Commanding General and in an effort to find some methodological common ground with respect to an Interrogation Plan for detainee [redacted] the FBI On-site Supervisor and Supervisors from the FBI Behavioral Analysis Unit met with JTF GTMO staff members on the evening of 20 November. During this meeting, DHS presented its draft Interrogation Plan. The FBI voiced misgivings about the overall coercive nature and possible illegality of elements of this plan. The FBI also voiced its strong objections regarding the efficacy of a fear-based approach.
The FBI offered in writing an alternative interrogation approach based on long term rapport-building. This approach was previously discussed extensively between FBI Behavioral experts and DHS and JTF staff members. At the 20 November meeting, DHS and JTF staff members recognized advantages of the FBI's approach, and decided to revise their plan by incorporating some of the FBI's rapport-building aspects. Despite the close working environment of this consultation, JIG and DHS staff never advised FBI personnel that the revised plan would be presented the following day to the Pentagon Office of General Counsel. In fact, the FBI representatives stated clearly to the JIG and DHS representative that the techniques proposed in the plan must be reviewed and formally approved by FBIHQ and BAU officials prior to any implementation.
Had the JIG advised the FBI of his intentions to present the revised DHS plan to DOD at the 21 November VTC as an FBI/DHS plan, FBI representatives would have strenuously objected. Additionally, although all agencies were aware that the NCIS Chief Psychologist, Dr. [redacted] was scheduled to arrive on 21 November for the purpose of evaluating the DHS and FBI plans, the JIG did not solicit Dr. [redacted] professional opinion.
This SOP document promulgates procedures to be followed by JTF-GTMO personnel engaged in interrogation operations on detained persons. The premise behind this is that the interrogation tactics used at U.S. military SERE schools are appropriate for use in real-world interrogations. These tactics and techniques are used at SERE school to ‘break' detainees. The same tactics and techniques can by used to break real detainees during interrogation operations.
In a late afternoon meeting, NCIS Director David Brant informed me that NCIS agents attached to JTF-160, the criminal investigation task force in Guantanamo, Cuba, had learned that some detainees confined in Guantanamo were being subjected to physical abuse and degrading treatment. This treatment—which the NCIS agents had not participated in or witnessed—was allegedly being inflicted by personnel attached to JTF-170, the intelligence task force, and was rumored to have been authorized, at least in part, at a “high level” in Washington, although NCIS had not seen the text of this authority. The NCIS agents at Guantanamo and civilian and military personnel from other services were upset at this mistreatment and regarded such treatment as unlawful and in violation of American values. Director Brant emphasized that NCIS would not engage in abusive treatment even if ordered to and did not wish to be even indirectly associated with a facility that engaged in such practices.
Director Brant asked me if I wished to learn more. Disturbed, I responded that I felt I had to. We agreed to meet again the following day. That evening, I emailed [Rear Admiral] Michael Lohr, the Navy JAG, and invited him to attend the next morning's meeting with NCIS.
If cruelty is no longer declared unlawful, but instead is applied as a matter of policy, it alters the fundamental relationship of man to government. It destroys the whole notion of individual rights. The Constitution recognizes that man has an inherent right, not bestowed by the state or laws, to personal dignity, including the right to be free of cruelty. It applies to all human beings, not just in America — even those designated as ‘unlawful enemy combatants.' If you make this exception, the whole Constitution crumbles. It's a transformative issue.”
18 Dec 02
I met with Director Brant and NCIS Chief Psychologist Dr. Michael Gelles. Dr. Gelles had advised JTF-160 in interrogation techniques and had spent time at the detention facility. Also present were OGC Deputy General Counsel William Molzahn, RADM Michael Lohr, and my Executive Assistant, CAPT Charlette Wise.
Dr. Gelles described conditions in Guantanamo and stated that guards and interrogators with JTF-170, who were under pressure to produce results, had begun using abusive techniques with some of the detainees. These techniques included physical contact, degrading treatment (including dressing detainees in female underwear, among other techniques), the use of “stress” positions, and coercive psychological procedures. The military interrogators believed that such techniques were not only useful, but were necessary to obtain the desired information. NCIS agents were not involved in the application of these techniques or witnesses to them, but had learned of them through discussions with personnel who had been involved and through access to computer databases where interrogation logs were kept. Dr. Gelles showed me extracts of detainee interrogation logs evidencing some of this detainee mistreatment.
These techniques, Dr. Gelles explained, would violate the interrogation guidelines taught to military and law enforcement personnel and he believed they were generally violative of U.S. law if applied to U.S. persons. In addition, there was a great danger, he said, that any force utilized to extract information would continue to escalate. If a person being forced to stand for hours decided to lie down, it probably would take force to get him to stand up again and stay standing. In contrast to the civilian law enforcement at Guantanamo, who were trained in interrogation techniques and limits and had years of professional experience in such practices, the military interrogators were typically young and had little or no training or experience interrogations. Once the initial barrier against the use of improper force had been breached, a phenomenon known as “force drift” would almost certainly begin to come into play. This term describes the observed tendency among interrogators who rely on force. If some force is good, these people come to believe, then the application of more force must be better. Thus, the level of force applied against an uncooperative witness tends to escalate such that, if left unchecked, force levels, to include torture, could be reached. Dr. Gelles was concerned that this phenomenon might manifest itself at Guantanamo.
Director Brant reiterated his previous statements that he and the NCIS personnel at Guantanamo viewed any such abusive practices as repugnant. They would not engage in them even if ordered and NCIS would have to consider whether they could even remain co-located in Guantanamo if the practices were to continue. Moreover, this discontent was not limited to NCIS; law enforcement and military personnel from other services were also increasingly disturbed by the practice.
Director Brant also repeated that NCIS had been informed that the coercive interrogation techniques did not represent simply rogue activity limited to undisciplined interrogators or even practices sanctioned only by the local command, but had been reportedly authorized at a “high level” in Washington. NCIS, however, had no further information on this.
The general mood in the room was dismay. I was of the opinion that the interrogation activities described would be unlawful and unworthy of the military services, an opinion that the others shared. I commended NCIS for their values and their decision to bring this to my attention. I also committed that I would try to find out more about the situation in Guantanamo , in particular whether any such interrogation techniques had received higher-level authorization.
19 Dec 02
Knowing that the Department of the Army had Executive Agent responsibility for Guantanamo detainee operations, I called Steven Morello, the Army General Counsel, and told him that I had heard of alleged interrogation abuse in Guantanamo. Mr. Morello responded that he had information on the issue and invited me to visit with him and his deputy, Tom Taylor, to discuss it further.
In the Army OGC offices, Mr. Morello and Mr. Taylor provided me with a copy of a composite document (Att 2) capped by an Action Memo from DOD General counsel William Haynes to the Secretary of Defense entitled “counter-Resistance Techniques.” The memo, which I had not seen before, evidenced that on December 2, 2002, Secretary Rumsfeld had approved the use of certain identified interrogation techniques at Guantanamo, including (with some restrictions) the use of stress positions, hooding, isolation, “deprivation of light and auditory stimuli,” and use of “detainee-individual phobias (such as fear of dogs) to induce stress.” This composite document (further referred to as the December 2 nd Memo”) showed that the request for the authority to employ the techniques had originated with an October 11, 2002, memorandum from MG Michael Dunlavey, the Commander of JTF-170, to the Commander, SOUTHCOM, and had proceeded up the chain of command through the Joint Staff until reaching the Secretary. The Dunlavey memo was accompanied by a legal brief signed by LTC Diane Beaver, the SJF to JTF-170, generally finding that application of the interrogation techniques complied with law.
Mr. Morello and Mr. Taylor demonstrated great concern with the decision to authorize the interrogation techniques. Mr. Morello said that “they had tried to stop it,” without success, and had been advised not to question the settled decision further.
Upon returning to my office, I reviewed the Secretary's December 2nd memo and the Beaver Legal Brief more closely. The brief held, in summary, that torture was prohibited but cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment could be inflicted on the Guantanamo detainees with near impunity because, at least in that location, no law prohibited such action, no court would be vested with jurisdiction to entertain a complaint on such allegations, and various defenses (such as good motive or necessity) would shield any U.S. official accused of the unlawful behavior. I regarded the memo as a wholly inadequate analysis of the law and a poor treatment of this difficult and highly sensitive issue. As for the December 2nd Memo, I concluded that it was fatally grounded on these serious failures of legal analysis. As described in the memo and supporting documentation, the interrogation techniques approved by the Secretary should not have been authorized because some (but not all) of them, whether applied singly or in combination, could produce effects reaching the level of torture, a degree of mistreatment not otherwise proscribed by the memo because it did not articulate any bright-line standard for prohibited detainee treatment, a necessary element in such a document. Furthermore, even if the techniques as applied did not reach the level of torture, they almost certainly would constitute “cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment,” another class of unlawful treatment.
In my view, the alleged detainee abuse, coupled with the fact that the Secretary of Defense's memo had authorized at least aspects of it, could—and almost certainly would—have severe ramifications unless the policy was quickly reversed. Any such mistreatment would be unlawful and contrary to the President's directive to treat the detainees “humanely.” In addition, the consequences of such practices were almost incalculably harmful to U.S. foreign, military, and legal policies. Because the American public would not tolerate such abuse, I felt the political fallout was likely to be severe.
I provided RADM Lohr with a copy of the December 2 nd Memo and requested that Navy JAG prepare a legal analysis of the issues. I also decided to brief Secretary of the Navy Gordon England and take my objections to DOD GC Haynes as quickly as possible.
Later that day, RADM Lohr wrote via email that he had brought the allegations of abuse to the attention of the Vice Chief of Naval Operations, ADM William Fallon. (Att 4)
20 Dec 02
At 1015, in a very short meeting, I briefed Navy Secretary Gordon England on the NCIS report of detainee abuse, on the December 2 nd Memo authorizing the interrogation techniques, and on my legal views and policy concerns. I told him I was planning to see DOD GC Haynes that afternoon to convey my concerns and objections. Secretary England authorized me to go forward, advising me to use my judgment.
That afternoon I met with Mr. Hayes in his office. I informed him that NCIS had advised me that interrogation abuses were taking place in Guantanamo, that the NCIS agents considered any such abuses to be unlawful and contrary to American values, and that discontent over these practices were reportedly spreading among the personnel on the base. Producing the December 2 nd Memo, I expressed surprise that the Secretary had been allowed to sign it. In my view, some of the authorized interrogation techniques could rise to the level of torture, although the intent surely had not been to do so. Mr. Haynes disagreed that the techniques authorized constituted torture. I urged him to think about the techniques more closely. What did “deprivation of light and auditory stimuli” mean? Could a detainee be locked in a completely dark cell? And for how long? A month? Longer? What precisely did the authority to exploit phobias permit? Could a detainee be held in a coffin? Could phobias be applied until madness set in? Not only could individual techniques applied singly constitute torture, I said, but also the application of combinations of them must surely be recognized as potentially capable of reaching the level of torture. Also, the memo's fundamental problem was that it was completely unbounded—it failed to establish a clear boundary for prohibited treatment. That boundary, I felt, had to be at that point where cruel and unusual punishment or treatment began. Turning to the Beaver Legal Brief, I characterized it as an incompetent product of legal analysis, and I urged him not to rely on it.
I also drew Mr. Haynes's attention to the Secretary's hand-written comment on the bottom of the memo, which suggested that detainees subjected to forced standing (which was limited to four hours) could be made to stand longer since he usually stood for longer periods during his work day. Although, having some sense of the Secretary's verbal style, I was confident the comment was intended to be jocular, defense attorneys for the detainees were sure to interpret it otherwise. Unless withdrawn rapidly, the memo was sure to be discovered and used at trial in the military commissions. The Secretary's signature on the memo ensured that he would be called as a witness. I told Mr. Haynes he could be sure that, at the end of what would be a long interrogation, the defense attorney would then refer the Secretary to the notation and ask whether it was not intended as a coded message, a written nod-and-a-wink to interrogators to the effect that they should not feel bound by the limits set in the memo, but consider themselves authorized to do what was necessary to obtain the necessary information. The memos, and the practices they authorized, threatened the entire military commission process.
Mr. Haynes listened attentively throughout. He promised to consider carefully what I had said.
I had entered the meeting believing that the December 2nd Memo was almost certainly not reflective of conscious policy but the product of oversight—a combination of too much work and too little time for careful legal analysis or measured consideration. I left confident that Mr. Haynes, upon reflecting on the abuse in Guantanamo and the flaws in the December 2 nd Memo and underlying legal analysis, would seek to correct these mistakes by obtaining the quick suspension of the authority to apply the interrogation techniques.
In some cases, highly trained CIA officers question captives through interpreters. In others, the intelligence agency undertakes a “false flag” operation using fake décor and disguises meant to deceive a captive into thinking he is imprisoned in a country with a reputation for brutality, when, in reality, he is still in CIA hands. Sometimes, female officers conduct interrogations, a psychologically jarring experience for men reared in a conservative Muslim culture where women are never in control.
6 Jan 03
NCIS director Brant informed me that the detainee mistreatment in Guantanamo was continuing and that he had not heard that the December 2nd Memo had been suspended or revoked. This came as an unpleasant surprise since I had been confident that the abusive activities would have been quickly ended once I brought them to the attention of higher levels within DOD. I began to wonder whether the adoption of the coercive interrogation techniques might not have been the product of simple oversight, as I had thought, but perhaps a policy consciously adopted—albeit through mistaken analysis—and enjoying at least some support within the Pentagon bureaucracy. To get them curbed I would have to develop a constituency within the Pentagon to do so.
I met with Mr. Haynes in his office again that afternoon. He was accompanied by an Air Force major whose name I cannot recall. I told him that I had been surprised to learn upon my return from vacation that the detainee abuses appeared to be continuing and that, from all appearances, the interrogation techniques authorized by the December 2nd Memo were still in place. I also provided him a draft copy of the Navy JAG legal memo.
Mr. Haynes did not explain what had happened during the interval, but said that some U.S. officials believed the techniques were necessary to obtain information from the few Guantanamo detainees who, it was thought, were involved in the 9/11 attacks and had knowledge of other al Qaeda operations planned against the United States. I acknowledged the ethical issues were difficult. I was not sure what my position would be in the classic “ticking bomb” scenario where the terrorist being interrogated had knowledge of, say, an imminent nuclear weapon attack against a U.S. city. If I were the interrogator involved, I would probably apply the torture myself, although I would do so with full knowledge of potentially severe personal consequences. But I did not feel this was the factual situation we faced in Guantanamo, and even if I were willing to do this as an individual and assume the personal consequences, by the same token I did not consider it appropriate for us to advocate for or cause the laws and values of our nation to be changed to render the activity lawful. Also, the threats against the United States came from many directions and had many different potential consequences. Does the threat by one common criminal against the life of one citizen justify torture or lesser mistreatment? If not, how many lives must the threat jeopardize? Where does one set the threshold, if at all? In any event, this was not for us to decide in the Pentagon; these were issues for national debate.
My recollection is that I raised the following additional points with Mr. Haynes:
• The December 26th Washington Post article recounting allegations of prisoner mistreatment at Guantanamo and elsewhere demonstrated that the discontent of those in the military opposed to the practice was leaking to the media, as was inevitable.
• Even if one wanted to authorize the U.S. military to conduct coercive interrogations, as was the case in Guantanamo, how could one do so without profoundly altering its core values and character? Societal education and military training inculcated in our soldiers American values adverse to mistreatment. Would we now have the military abandon these values altogether? Or would we create detachments of special guards and interrogators, who would be trained and kept separate from the other soldiers, to administer these practices?
• The belief held by some that Guantanamo 's special jurisdictional situation would preclude a U.S. court finding jurisdiction to review events occurring there was questionable at best. The coercive interrogations in Guantanamo were not committed by rogue elements of the military acting without authority, a situation that may support a finding of lack of jurisdiction. In this situation, the authority and direction to engage in the practice issued from and was under review by the highest DOD authorities, including the Secretary of Defense. What precluded a federal district court from finding jurisdiction along the entire length of the chain of command?
• The British government had applied virtually the same interrogation techniques against Irish Republican Army detainees in the ‘70s. Following an exhaustive investigation in which the testimony of hundreds of witnesses was taken, the European Commission of Human rights found the interrogation techniques to constitute torture. In Ireland v. United Kingdom , a later lawsuit brought by the victims of the interrogation techniques, the European court of Human Rights in a split decision held that the techniques did not rise to the level of torture, but did amount to “cruel, inhuman, and degrading” treatment, a practice that was equally in violation of European law and international human rights standards. The court awarded damages. Ultimately, the then-Prime Minister, standing in the well of Parliament, admitted that the government had used the techniques, forswore their further use, and announced further investigations and remedial training. This case was directly applicable to our situation for two reasons. First, because of the similarity between U.S. and U.K. jurisprudence, the case helped establish that the interrogation techniques authorized in the December 2 nd Memo constituted, at a minimum, cruel, inhuman, and degrading treatment. Further, depending on circumstances, the same treatment may constitute torture—treatment that may discomfit a prizefighter may be regarded as torture by a grandmother. Second, at present, British Prime Minister Tony Blair had lost significant electoral support and was under heavy political pressure because of his staunch support for the United States in the War on Terror and Operation Iraqi Freedom. What would be the impact on Blair's political standing upon the disclosure that his partner, the United States , was engaged in practices that were unlawful under British and European law? Could the British Government be precluded from continuing to cooperate with us on aspects of the War on Terror because doing so would abet illegal activity? Besides Blair, what impact would our actions have with respect to the willingness of other European leaders, all of whom are subject to the same law, to participate with us in the War on Terror?
• A central element of American foreign policy for decades had been our support for human rights. By authorizing and practicing cruel, inhuman, and degrading treatment, we were now engaged in the same sort of practices that we routinely condemned. He we jettisoned our human rights policies? If not, could we continue to espouse them given our inconsistent behavior?
Mr. Haynes said little during our meeting. Frustrated by not having made much apparent headway, I told him that the interrogation policies could threaten Secretary Rumsfeld's tenure and could even damage the Presidency. “Protect your client.” I urged Mr. Haynes.
After the meeting, I reported back to Mr. Durnan by email (Att 9) Two sentences summarized my view of the meeting. Speaking of Mr. Haynes, I wrote: “He listened—as he always does—closely and intently to my arguments and promised to get back to me, but didn't say when. I've got no inkling what impact, if any, I made.
Uncertain whether there would be any change to the interrogation policy and dissatisfied at what I viewed as the slow pace of the discussions, I prepared a draft memorandum addressed to Mr. Haynes and CAPT Dalton (Att 12) providing my views on the JTF-170 October 11, 2002 request (contained as part of the December 2 nd Memo) requesting authority to engage in the counter-resistance interrogation techniques. My memo: (a) stated that the majority of the proposed category II and all of the category III techniques were violative of domestic and international legal norms in that they constituted, at a minimum, cruel and unusual treatment and, at worst, torture; (b) rejected the legal analysis and recommendations of the Beaver Legal Brief; and (c) “strongly non-concurred” with the adoption of the violative interrogation techniques. The memo further cautioned that even “the misperception that the U.S. Government authorizes or condones detention or interrogation practices that do not comply with our domestic and international legal obligations ... probably will cause significant harm to our national legal, political, military and diplomatic interests.”

Matthew Alexander 10/01/10: Here we have a civilian lawyer, with no military service background, having the courage to do what no other senior military member in the Pentagon was willing to do -- take a stand against torture. His actions were no less than heroic and will serve as an example of courageous dissent for future generations of Americans.
I delivered the memo in draft form to Mr. Haynes's office in the morning. In a telephone call, I told Mr. Haynes that I was increasingly uncomfortable as time passed because I had not put down in writing my views on the interrogation issues. I said I would be signing out the memo late that afternoon unless I heard definitively that use of the interrogation techniques had been or was being suspended. We agreed to meet later that day.
In the later meeting, which Mr. Dell'Orto attended, Mr. Haynes returned the draft to me. He asked whether I was not aware of how he felt about the issues or the impact of my actions. I responded that I did not and, with respect to his own views, I had no idea whether he agreed totally with my arguments, disagreed totally with them, or held an intermediate view. Mr. Haynes then said that Secretary Rumsfeld would be suspending the authority to apply the techniques that same day. I said I was delighted and would thus not be signing out my memo. Later in the day and after our meeting, Mr. Haynes called to confirm that Secretary Rumsfeld had suspended the techniques. I reported the news widely, including to the Under Secretary (Att 13) and VADM Green (Att 14).
Bookmark/Search this post with:
Comments
We intend the comments portion of this blog to be a forum where you can freely express your views on blog postings and on comments made by other people. Given that, please understand that you are responsible for the material you post on the comments portion of this blog. The only postings that we ask that you refrain from posting and that we cannot permit on our website are requests for legal assistance and postings that could cause ACLU to incur legal liability.One important law in that regard is the prohibition on politically partisan activity. Given our nonprofit status, we may not endorse or oppose candidates for elective office. That means we cannot host comments on our site that show a preference for one candidate or party. Although we in no way wish to discourage you from that activity elsewhere, we ask that you not engage in that activity on our website (or include links to other websites that do so). Additionally, given that we are subject to very specific rules concerning the collection of personally identifying information through our website (names, email addresses, home address, financial information, etc.), we ask that you not use the comments portion of this blog to solicit this information from users of our website. We also ask that you not use the comments portion for advertising or requests for legal assistance, and do not add to your comment links to other websites, as we cannot be responsible for the content on other websites.
We are not able to respond to unsolicited inquiries, complaints or requests for assistance sent to this blog. Please direct your complaint or request for assistance to the ACLU affiliate in your state. Requests for legal assistance left in the blog comments will not receive a response or be published.
Finally, the ACLU cannot guarantee the accuracy, completeness or usefulness of any information in the comment section and expressly disclaims any liability for any information in this section.
Post new comment